3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Please post all topics here related to the research and gaining finding permission to metal detect.
cammann
Posts: 291
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:53 pm
Location: cambridge
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 90 times

3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by cammann »

Feeling pretty gutted after both of my permissions have informed me they are leasing their land out to other farmers for the next 3 years - meaning I've lost slightly over 3000 acres.

Has anyone else lost land of late due to the original landowner leasing out their land? It could be a coincidence but to have them both saying it was being leased out for the same period seems quite a coincidence so I'm curious whether there's some driving force (e.g. crop prices) behind this as both are crop farmers with no livestock.
Last edited by cammann on Sun Oct 27, 2019 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.


Minelab Equinox 800
XP Deus
Garret Pro Pointer
Minelab Explorer SE Pro
Minelab Safari
Garret Ace 250
Best find - medieval gold posy ring and the quiet enjoyment of the countryside.

User avatar
Oxgirl36
Moderator
Posts: 12667
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 6:54 pm
Location: A Lancastrian living in sunny Oxfordshire
Has thanked: 5160 times
Been thanked: 5985 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Oxgirl36 »

There’s always the chance that the people leasing it will let you continue? Worth asking ::g

P.S. and meant to say sorry for the position you’re in :((
Carpe vinum

XP Deus !!£$ I use the HOT programme on 17khz, reactivity at 2.5 on v5.21 with the X35 11” coil

littlehove
Posts: 305
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:06 pm
Has thanked: 88 times
Been thanked: 104 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by littlehove »

I agree with oxgirl. It has to be worth asking the people who lease the land. When you tell them that the owner had given you permission there's every chance that the lessee will too.

jcmaloney
Posts: 2335
Joined: Tue Apr 12, 2011 9:17 am
Has thanked: 826 times
Been thanked: 438 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by jcmaloney »

The leases can be complex affairs where the lease holder has total control over the arable cycle, crop to crop and the landowner gets the stewardship/subs payment and/or a % of the yields.

Nothing to be lost by asking. ::g
Opinions expressed on MY posts are mine and NOT those of any democratic organisation I volunteer for. ::g

User avatar
oldartefact
Posts: 8419
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2012 12:31 am
Location: Gods own county - numero uno!
Has thanked: 1913 times
Been thanked: 1521 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by oldartefact »

I know that uncertainty about the future outlook for farming has created some nervousness in the rural community, one of the knock on effects maybe that some landowners look to reduce uncertainty by leasing out their land, and let others take the risk.
Imagine there is no heaven, only sky above us.

User avatar
stanslad
Posts: 1908
Joined: Tue Apr 03, 2012 7:45 pm
Location: North Oxfordshire
Has thanked: 358 times
Been thanked: 313 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by stanslad »

Sorry to hear that, but a word with new farmers could work in your favour as you were already doing the land,
perhaps if they say yes carry on, they could also have other land they farm already you could get on as well & gain another permission,
Good luck.
Clint ::g

User avatar
Ladybird66
Posts: 2439
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:03 pm
Location: Pembrokeshire
Has thanked: 937 times
Been thanked: 1805 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Ladybird66 »

I had the same thing happen to me a few years ago. Not 3000 acres but just as important to me.
That was also a 3 year lease agreement and as far as the owner was concerned he no longer had any say over who went on that land.
I asked if I could contact the new renter and was advised against it. Owner said he was an awkward sort of fella and he didn’t want me upsetting him. I just moved on, found another permission. He was a pain in the neck anyway !

Looks like you’ll have to put it on the back burner till 2022. Give you something to look forward to :D

User avatar
Easylife
Posts: 5756
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:23 pm
Has thanked: 1622 times
Been thanked: 3108 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Easylife »

Just wondering, is this a case of having all of your eggs in the same basket? x;
Nox 800, 15" coil & Garrett carrot.
White's TDI SL

cammann
Posts: 291
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:53 pm
Location: cambridge
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 90 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by cammann »

Easylife wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:43 am
Just wondering, is this a case of having all of your eggs in the same basket? x;
Lol, you mean 2 baskets separated by size, location and organisational type?
Minelab Equinox 800
XP Deus
Garret Pro Pointer
Minelab Explorer SE Pro
Minelab Safari
Garret Ace 250
Best find - medieval gold posy ring and the quiet enjoyment of the countryside.

cammann
Posts: 291
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:53 pm
Location: cambridge
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 90 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by cammann »

Thanks all. I'll be contacting the new lessee of one of the permissions (I dont yet know who's got the smaller one) and who knows where that'll lead. If they're large enough to swallow 3000 acres I may end up with 6000 if I get a positive response! Either way, the worst they can say is no so it doesn't hurt anyone to ask.
Minelab Equinox 800
XP Deus
Garret Pro Pointer
Minelab Explorer SE Pro
Minelab Safari
Garret Ace 250
Best find - medieval gold posy ring and the quiet enjoyment of the countryside.

User avatar
Bradrick
Posts: 2875
Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:07 pm
Location: South Cambs
Has thanked: 2808 times
Been thanked: 1460 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Bradrick »

Easylife wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:43 am
Just wondering, is this a case of having all of your eggs in the same basket? x;
Good point and very relevant to another thread. ::g
Equinox 800
Garrett 400i
C-Scope 1220b

My life has been full of terrible misfortunes most of which never happened.

Life is difficult. Once we truly know that life is difficult and we truly understand and accept it, then life is no longer difficult.

User avatar
shaggybfc
Posts: 1123
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 7:53 pm
Location: Warwick
Has thanked: 671 times
Been thanked: 701 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by shaggybfc »

Sorry to hear of your situation. It is certainly worth the ask, is it not?
I’m going to be losing a bit of land. The land owner, previous farmer, who leases out the land to another farmer, but all good for me to detect from both parties. The new farmer has just informed me that he’d be taking some government money under the stewardship scheme, therefore a few fields will be out of bounds as from October. I’m not too concerned, they were pretty quiet anyway and it’s only a small % of the land I have access to. I’d rather lose access due to wild flower growing, than to these FB pay to dig groups.
Good luck.
Last edited by shaggybfc on Sun Oct 27, 2019 7:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
XP Deus, 11" X35 coil, WS4 back-phones, remote and an empty bank balance. XP MI 6 pin pointer. Garrett Ace 250 wireless MPow set up.
They told me I’d never be any good at poetry, because I’m dyslexic, but so far I’ve made 3 jugs and a vase.

User avatar
andy1973
Posts: 204
Joined: Thu May 16, 2019 12:11 pm
Has thanked: 146 times
Been thanked: 113 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by andy1973 »

I would ask, seeing u already have the land owners permission that should go in your favour :) good luck and let us know how you get on
Makro Kruzer 3 tone
M.A.D member
"I'm praying I find Roman before my wife... else i'll never live it down"
Gold posy ring.
oldest coin so far 1465..not even english lol
Still searching for Roman and Saxon.

cammann
Posts: 291
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:53 pm
Location: cambridge
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 90 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by cammann »

I'll report back and let you know the result when I hear back from the new tenant.
Minelab Equinox 800
XP Deus
Garret Pro Pointer
Minelab Explorer SE Pro
Minelab Safari
Garret Ace 250
Best find - medieval gold posy ring and the quiet enjoyment of the countryside.

User avatar
Albus
Posts: 74
Joined: Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:46 pm
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 33 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Albus »

Most of my best permission was rendered virtually useless after I arrived one Saturday morning and found the main field totally occupied with caravans tens etc and a HUGE amount of detectorists wandering around. I would suspect at least 150. I dont blame the farmer he needed the money but the organiser could have at least had the decency to ask or tell me.
Thats the way detecting's going now. Paid sites.

cammann
Posts: 291
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:53 pm
Location: cambridge
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 90 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by cammann »

Albus wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:43 pm
Most of my best permission was rendered virtually useless after I arrived one Saturday morning and found the main field totally occupied with caravans tens etc and a HUGE amount of detectorists wandering around. I would suspect at least 150. I dont blame the farmer he needed the money but the organiser could have at least had the decency to ask or tell me.
Thats the way detecting's going now. Paid sites.
Sorry to hear that Albus - that must be pretty gutting.
Minelab Equinox 800
XP Deus
Garret Pro Pointer
Minelab Explorer SE Pro
Minelab Safari
Garret Ace 250
Best find - medieval gold posy ring and the quiet enjoyment of the countryside.

User avatar
oldartefact
Posts: 8419
Joined: Sun Dec 30, 2012 12:31 am
Location: Gods own county - numero uno!
Has thanked: 1913 times
Been thanked: 1521 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by oldartefact »

Albus wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:43 pm
Most of my best permission was rendered virtually useless after I arrived one Saturday morning and found the main field totally occupied with caravans tens etc and a HUGE amount of detectorists wandering around. I would suspect at least 150. I dont blame the farmer he needed the money but the organiser could have at least had the decency to ask or tell me.
Thats the way detecting's going now. Paid sites.
I would like to stress that I truly feel very very sorry for your predicament.. I wouldnt like it if it happened to me. That said the contract to detect or not, is entirely between the landowner and the rally organiser, sadly consideration of other detectorists already on the land is completely out of the equation. That said if you had an agreement with the landowner, that you should be consulted prior to organised events, you may have a case. I'm afraid that organised events coming onto our permissions, is something we have to take on the chin. Its a bitter pill to swallow for those of us being displaced, but that is just how it is.
edit ... I would add that obtaining a permission does not oblige the landowner to then act in one's favour, and neither does it oblige any other party (rally organiser, or otherwise) to act in one's favour. The "one man only permission", is a bit of a myth, tbh I am not sure how the idea of "one person, one permission" originated. Maybe there is someone out there who can explain. Hopefully in more words than "that is how we did it in the 70's"
edit edit ... On the plus side if an organised event hit one of "my fields" I would be gutted, but at the same time glowing in the knowledge that I got there first ... :) :) :)
Imagine there is no heaven, only sky above us.

Pete E
Posts: 788
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2019 3:59 pm
Location: North Wales
Has thanked: 593 times
Been thanked: 292 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Pete E »

Albus wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:43 pm
Most of my best permission was rendered virtually useless after I arrived one Saturday morning and found the main field totally occupied with caravans tens etc and a HUGE amount of detectorists wandering around. I would suspect at least 150. I dont blame the farmer he needed the money but the organiser could have at least had the decency to ask or tell me.
Thats the way detecting's going now. Paid sites.
Very sorry to hear that...Its instances like this why I don't mind targeting smaller areas to ask for permission. I would rather have 10 small parcels of land with different owners than just one large farm...
Makro Racer 2
Makro Pinpointer
August EP650 Wireless headphones
TaoTronics Wireless Portable Transmitter, (Bluetooth 4.1, aptX Low Latency)

User avatar
littleboot
Posts: 3347
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:22 pm
Location: Normandy (the cider and cheese area)
Has thanked: 1243 times
Been thanked: 2207 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by littleboot »

Albus wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:43 pm
Most of my best permission was rendered virtually useless after I arrived one Saturday morning and found the main field totally occupied with caravans tens etc and a HUGE amount of detectorists wandering around. I would suspect at least 150. I dont blame the farmer he needed the money but the organiser could have at least had the decency to ask or tell me.
Thats the way detecting's going now. Paid sites.
It is very unfortunate and I hope you find another site soon. I hope you got some good stuff of it before they had their rally.
Having said that, why should the organisers tell you? Its a contract between the landowner and them. You just happen to have been the happy beneficiary of some free detecting for however long it was.
Equinox 600, GMP, wellies.

littlehove
Posts: 305
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:06 pm
Has thanked: 88 times
Been thanked: 104 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by littlehove »

Albus wrote:
Sun Sep 15, 2019 5:43 pm
Most of my best permission was rendered virtually useless after I arrived one Saturday morning and found the main field totally occupied with caravans tens etc and a HUGE amount of detectorists wandering around. I would suspect at least 150. I dont blame the farmer he needed the money but the organiser could have at least had the decency to ask or tell me.
Thats the way detecting's going now. Paid sites.
I too would have been totally gutted if this happened to me and I'm sorry but the fact that I had had the opportunity to detect on it previously would not have made me feel any better about it.

User avatar
littleboot
Posts: 3347
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:22 pm
Location: Normandy (the cider and cheese area)
Has thanked: 1243 times
Been thanked: 2207 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by littleboot »

Well in my view the most positive and practical way to look at it is to be thankful for what you had and move on and concentrate on moving forward with other permissions.
I've 'lost' countless acres to Greenwaste and there is little point in being upset about it. It is what it is. The farmer has a living to make and I am thankful for any time I have spent on his land pootling around with my hobby.
Equinox 600, GMP, wellies.

littlehove
Posts: 305
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:06 pm
Has thanked: 88 times
Been thanked: 104 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by littlehove »

Everyone has their own take on it. As someone once said it takes all sorts to make a world. 🙂

User avatar
littleboot
Posts: 3347
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 5:22 pm
Location: Normandy (the cider and cheese area)
Has thanked: 1243 times
Been thanked: 2207 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by littleboot »

indeed I did. And no-one is suggesting that your take is any more or less valid than mine. B-)
Equinox 600, GMP, wellies.

User avatar
Keef the Frog
Posts: 457
Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2017 3:36 pm
Location: Vendée en France
Has thanked: 70 times
Been thanked: 248 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Keef the Frog »

All part of life's rich tapestry :))
Great free fishing lost to syndicates, bottle dumps lost to new roads, fossiling sites buried in sand etc...…..
Rolling about naked in mud will give the wrong impression.

User avatar
kenleyboy
Posts: 1096
Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2017 12:44 pm
Location: Norfolk
Has thanked: 1486 times
Been thanked: 1139 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by kenleyboy »

Keef the Frog wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:38 am
All part of life's rich tapestry :))
Great free fishing lost to syndicates, bottle dumps lost to new roads, fossiling sites buried in sand etc...…..
Too true , just lost "our" largest and most productive bottle dump to planners . We barely scratched the surface but it is what it is !
I walk , I dig , I find ....naff all !

User avatar
Keef the Frog
Posts: 457
Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2017 3:36 pm
Location: Vendée en France
Has thanked: 70 times
Been thanked: 248 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Keef the Frog »

kenleyboy wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 7:30 am
Keef the Frog wrote:
Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:38 am
All part of life's rich tapestry :))
Great free fishing lost to syndicates, bottle dumps lost to new roads, fossiling sites buried in sand etc...…..
Too true , just lost "our" largest and most productive bottle dump to planners . We barely scratched the surface but it is what it is !
Ours was a killer dump right in the middle of Bury St. Edmunds. It also had been barely touched even though one afternoon we had 70ish Codds out =)) . It's now all under Parkway.
Rolling about naked in mud will give the wrong impression.

Grave digger
Posts: 22
Joined: Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:54 pm
Location: St. Helens merseyside
Has thanked: 12 times
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Grave digger »

Sorry to here that cammann' the same thing happened to me 2 years back , I had permission on Lord darbbys nr Liverpool and I wnt up one day and the farmer said sorry mate the land owner has changed so no moor digging for a until the next meting . I am still waiting 2 years on. Gutted 😩

cammann
Posts: 291
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:53 pm
Location: cambridge
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 90 times

UPDATE Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by cammann »

Finally heard from the new tenant landowner. I emailed him asking if he'd be happy with me detecting on the land he 's letting in exchange for free IT support as thats what I'd been doing with the original landowner. He asked me to contact his colleague who sent this:

"Hi Alex

Thanks for the enquiry.

We are fine for you to become a member of our metal detecting scheme, annual membership is £240 and runs from April - March. As you would be joining late we can reduce to £120 (taking you to March 2020).

If you would like to proceed please share your full name and address and we will share our contract with you.

Thanks

Simon"

My first thought was £240 quid.... thats dearer than a years membership in some gyms around here in Cambridge! Then again, land is an expensive thing to own or rent and £240 would still work out at around the same price as paying for a dig every month. I guess in the absence of anything better around here I may have to consider it.
Minelab Equinox 800
XP Deus
Garret Pro Pointer
Minelab Explorer SE Pro
Minelab Safari
Garret Ace 250
Best find - medieval gold posy ring and the quiet enjoyment of the countryside.

User avatar
Bradrick
Posts: 2875
Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:07 pm
Location: South Cambs
Has thanked: 2808 times
Been thanked: 1460 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by Bradrick »

Your call Alex, but if the land has proven potential I'd be tempted. Is that for exclusive access?
Equinox 800
Garrett 400i
C-Scope 1220b

My life has been full of terrible misfortunes most of which never happened.

Life is difficult. Once we truly know that life is difficult and we truly understand and accept it, then life is no longer difficult.

cammann
Posts: 291
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2016 5:53 pm
Location: cambridge
Has thanked: 81 times
Been thanked: 90 times

Re: 3000 acres lost in 2 weeks.

Post by cammann »

Most businesses selling an annual membership for £240 would offer a description of the product being offered, but not this one. No mention of the area, number of other members with access to the same fields. Nor mention of where and when we can or cant go i.e. not fields with crops etc.
Minelab Equinox 800
XP Deus
Garret Pro Pointer
Minelab Explorer SE Pro
Minelab Safari
Garret Ace 250
Best find - medieval gold posy ring and the quiet enjoyment of the countryside.

Post Reply

Return to “Permissions Forum”