Livery buttons

Please post any finds here that you wish help with identification.
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Paulmlpss
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Livery buttons

Post by Paulmlpss » Sun Nov 10, 2019 8:12 pm

Hello I found these 3 buttons today in a stubble field with my ace 400i. Can anyone help with and ID and possibly a date at all? Any help much appreciated.
Thanks Paul.
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DiOz
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Re: Livery buttons

Post by DiOz » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:07 pm

The one on the right is a family livery button, but you may need to post a pic that shows the detail better, as knowing what the motto is and/or if the lion is holding something could help to ID the family, and knowing whereabouts the button was found may also help.
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Re: Livery buttons

Post by fred » Sun Nov 10, 2019 9:10 pm

Middle one looks early to mid19thC and not sure about the other one. ::g
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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Paulmlpss » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:11 pm

Thanks for your help. Will post another photo tomorrow as I've posted 4 today. I did try looking myself but there was loads of lion buttons. Couldn't find any that matched. Is there anything I can do to help bring detail out a bit?

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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Koala » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:31 pm

Firmin
London

Firmin without the "S" "Ltd" or Sons" is quite unusual


I can only see one mention

https://www.ukdfd.co.uk/pages/button-ma ... ml#anchora

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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Paulmlpss » Mon Nov 11, 2019 4:54 am

Koala wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:31 pm
Firmin
London

Firmin without the "S" "Ltd" or Sons" is quite unusual


I can only see one mention

https://www.ukdfd.co.uk/pages/button-ma ... ml#anchora
It has got the s on. It says firmins London on the back. Wish I could see what it says above the lion but can't really see it.

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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Oxgirl36 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:47 am

Is the first button silver? Maybe it’s just the light.
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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Wigeon » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:04 am

Paulmlpss wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:11 pm
Thanks for your help. Will post another photo tomorrow as I've posted 4 today. I did try looking myself but there was loads of lion buttons. Couldn't find any that matched. Is there anything I can do to help bring detail out a bit?
A gentle rub with fine wire wool may bring out some more detail.
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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Paulmlpss » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:06 am

Wigeon wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:04 am
Paulmlpss wrote:
Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:11 pm
Thanks for your help. Will post another photo tomorrow as I've posted 4 today. I did try looking myself but there was loads of lion buttons. Couldn't find any that matched. Is there anything I can do to help bring detail out a bit?
A gentle rub with fine wire wool may bring out some more detail.
Thanks will give it a try.

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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Paulmlpss » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:07 am

Oxgirl36 wrote:
Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:47 am
Is the first button silver? Maybe it’s just the light.
It doesn't look it. Is there a way I can test it? Might just be dull and need cleaning.

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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Oxgirl36 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:49 am

You could do the spit and foil test on the back. Spit on a square of flat foil. Place on the silver and gently move it. If it smells of rotten eggs then it’s silver. If it doesn’t it still might be, but probably isn’t.

It could be a pewter type alloy which has a silver type look though but it does have a tarnished silver patina in that photo :D

P.S. just notice it has a tudor rose on it, doesn’t it?
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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Paulmlpss » Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:55 am

Yes it looks like a rose. I'll give the foil test a go when I get home. Thanks for the help.

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Re: Livery buttons

Post by Paulmlpss » Mon Nov 11, 2019 8:28 pm

Yes it is silver I did a foil test God it stinks lol. Does it only work with spit or would of water been Ok? Is it a Tudor rose button then?
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